No.29296[Last 50 Posts]
One of >>27825
torture festival events is Gurovision, where various performances are done on stage, as well as guro and just plain erotic fashion show. In some cases there will be "making of …" followup where it will be shown more on "how it was done" on that other thread.
Here, all action will happen on the stage.
The first and longest longest of them all is this extreme magic show.
Performers are professionals so do to try to repeat at home LOL
(this kind of show is actually known to be performed in Asia but here you will see erotic version)
You also can try to guess where that rabbit go LOL
suggestion: If the rabbit fits in the hat, so would the little girl. Right? ;)
Fitting little girl into hat… who could have thought that?
Did anyone diagnosed you with schizoid personality yet? LOL
But yes that will happen a bit later. We only may need do do something to fit her there ;) I will leave it for your imagination how.
Forget the rabbit….where did the magic wand go? ;-)
Waiting for the 'Dissapearing clothes"act.
the little girl can raise her has up over her head, then her clothes magically comes off and then her ass cheeks (1 cheek at a time come off) by magic, then she can fit in the hat. once her feet line up at the bottom of the hat they come off too.
Followed by the 'Dissapering limbs'act.
When Bunny returns, it's proved to be a flesh eating bunny. Which constitutes the start of the 'Dissapearing limbs' act…….
LOL, now I have to think of a certain rabbit with 3 pointed teeth
Onix, you always can surprise and that is not to say how many things you are doing at once.And not only here but also on Pixiv.So thank you for all your creative work!
Oh I really like where this is going.
Also I think that her arm is pretty short and thin, she might be able to get it in shoulder deep LOL
Last picture today.>>29366
yes she got it all inside LOL
Now I wonder if I should do more fisting in this show or not.
yes she can do more fisting butt she will loose her arm instead. Then she will panic and try to get her arm back with her other arm and she will also loose it.
Hey Onix, great work.
I just had a fun perverted idea that would fit perfect into your magic show:
- call a boy and girl from the audience
- have them both sawn in half
- SWITCH the lower halfs around and glue/magic them back together :)
Only bisexual people would like the outcome of that one lmao
I dunno, sounds like fun to me. The whole appeal here is children treating sex (and by extension guro) as just a game, so it fits just well if they don't care if it's a boy or a girl. It's sexy to see sex be not sexual.
So actually I'd love to see that. Bonus points if they are twins.
You know it may be had to convince audience to agree to be cut in half :)
you need to trick them into that somehow ;)
This unfortunately requires adding many more characters to the scene and I don't want to do that for memory issues. I may do it later in the end of this show.
Currently I have a bit diffrent idea about something similar. >>29412
It can be solved if we make guy feminine enuogh or else I think nobody wants to look at some bald tranny with bald head beard and pussy.
But if we make guy cute then there will be no big difference between before and after anyway >>29425
This may work as another show of sex change operation
lol it sounds like a stupid idea, but it's also never been done before(?). I like it because it does permanent change in a painful guro way.
If you dont want boys in the show just take two girls, maybe with different skin colors.
And if you want more stupid ideas with magic and cutting kids in half, how about this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6vYKJerstg
>>29436>lol it sounds like a stupid idea, but it's also never been done before(?). I like it because it does permanent change in a painful guro way.
what are you talking about here?
I have nothing against boys
and that idea you suggested was also in my mind ;) not sure if I will do it because even if I can do it it, has to fit in the story somehow and not get too repetitive.
It's her plush bunny's ear :D
Hmmm….. It is going to be a whole bloody rabbit.
I'm telling you again. That nice bunny has turned into a vicious little carnivore. A distant relative to the killer rabbit in Monty Python's 'The Holy Grale'.
It's going to get bloody from here…..
Congratulations! It's a …. bunny?
awesome update :-)
I still don't trust that rabbit…
I won't be surprised when that nice little rabbit suddenly changes into that ferocious meatgrinder that devoueres limbs like cookies…….
incidentlly, with cows that have a prolapse like that after they calve, you use a bottle like that to get the womb back in and in shape.
First bunny now the bottle is gone
This scene is actually made according to one joke which describes similar situation. Does anyone can remember it ? :)
awesome portal application :)
just a regular "nice work, Onix!" again ;)
I'm a huge fan of through-and-through stuff and i'm exited to see such a huge dildo. I wonder if we can spit another girl with it? Ass-to-mouth-style?
Hmm. that dildo is a bit too big to fit in the mouth but maybe it will happen somehow :) But only for short time or she may suffocate ;)>>29705
you cracked the secret of this trick LOL
once it's part way in the red hair girls ass, have it come back out of the little girls mouth
Almost guessed it LOL
but the trick is not finished yet. you will see the rest another day
Hey, where did her prolapse go? It "magically" went back to normal >;)
No need for magic for that. It has no use.
I'm absolutely loving your Gurovision magic show so far! You're being super creative right now; please keep that up. The age and size difference of the girls makes it additionally thrilling and the level of their insertions is superb. Can't wait to see more!
Awesome daisy chain !!!! :-)
I see some potential for a "Matryoshka doll" scenario here. Only need to make a knot, then keep pulling :)
think even if this girls is small she will not fit in her ass at that pose LOL
Thats why magic shows come with saws
Maybe not in plain sight, just hide her under the magic cloth while pulling her in ;)
But the better trick likely would be to push it into the little girl's mouth and have it come out of the dark haired's one this time.
Hmm do they have names? We should call them something. The dark haire'd witch looks like an Alice, that would make the red haired one a Sandy and the loli little Lilly.
Just to have a nametag on them for discussion ;)
hmm, I had a bit different plan here but your suggestion will be useful for the end of that trick ;)>>29881
Actually, something similar should happen later ;)
I am just trying to make tricks gradually more extreme >>29883
Speaking about names, I didn't think any, because this story has no text or even narration and thus no way to tell those names.
The names you gave to them are good and easy to remember, so let's use them from now on. Maybe later I will make some extra page with character descriptions.
Not sure if this is against your principles for this story, though I find that after getting to know and appreciating those girls for quite some time, it'd make it A LOT more dramatic and thrilling if they got executed during a trick in the end of the show. Do you like them too much or would you do that to them?
I hope in the future we can expect some trick with traffic cone. :)
Considering the tricks they are doing and are going to do later, you can assume them to be pretty much immortal and impossible to kill LOL.
So even if they will get executed they will not die because this is a magic show, not execution.
If you want to see them "die" as an alternate "ending" this is possible and maybe I will do that since it is actually a pretty good idea for "dramatic" ending. I just wonder if anyone will believe that they die ;)
I still don't know how what could happen, as what kind of trick can end with them all dying unless they literally commit suicide.
Probably no, as this trick with dido will be the last thing involving object insertion and fisting and then it will get more 'dangerous'
Thanks, I'm waiting impatiently for the sequel.
We may see a traffic cone by some other thing :)
now back in the little girls ass
So this is the last of softcore tricks
and now it is time to get serious ;)
I am very excited and horny!
Maybe some rigid impalement?
disappearing body parts
Why not fisting a little girl in the ass and exit the hand from the mouth with a dozen of roses, and fisting with other arm a pussy and get out a bottle of champagne (better if is a magnum). Is funny if ass and pussy are with extreme prolapse.
I think it is enough of fisting or else we will never come to anything guro related ;)>>30039
something like that will happen later.
now I will do something what you are requesting all the time.>>30034
Possible but I think this is done way too many times already it cannot be turned into some interesting trick with unexpected results and it may require way more work than other tricks, because if she gets skewered like that she will not be able to walk or stand anymore.
disappearing ass cheeks?
No that another request LOL
Maybe separated body parts then! Like sawing in half or beheading.
Yes, that will happen later or how you can have decent magic without sawing someone into pieces LOL
I want the smallest girl to have her arms removed. In a non-painful manner, but she had to be thoroughly surprised and embarrassed. Also she has to stay this way after the show end, naked and armless.
The teen girl can flayed alive, including the skin from her face. She has to be aware and and in great discomfort of her disfigurement, but not in horrible pain. After that she should walk around freely, assisting with the next trick.
The oldest lady should get the either acid bath treatment or being boiled alive, feet first. Slowly and in full pain level. She is not expected to survive. At the end the now armless youngest girl and skinless teen girl should bid farewell to the public.
Well, this is a magic show not torture or execution, so you can suspect that in the end it should all end well.
and they should all get back to normal eventually.
If you want torture death you need to request that as as separate series >>30066
Yes, that should happen to some extent ;)>>30067
Removing skin is something what is too hard to do in 3d. Maybe I will manage to do that sometime to some extent someday ;) I can make skin disappear as whole but I can't show process of skinning.>>30068
Boiling someone on stage is again too hard to do.
What about classic trick with sawing girl in half? But this time we must see the whole process. After sawing girl will be magically restored…
This way I will spoil everything LOL
but yes this is also in my plan
however it will get gradually more extreme so most extreme tricks will come in the end.
How about some age play?
Make the girl into a teenager, the teenager into a woman and the magician into a girl.
Have the bunny turn into a grown man in a bunny costume (with a big cock) and do a homage to Waldo.
Don't forget the champagne bottle has to come out. When its coming out, break it. Have someone stamp on her belly and smash it while it is inside. Have the shards stick out.
You constantly comment in my threads and I have done that very seldom in your threads. I have to apologize for that.
Same as my stories don't meet your tastes, your stories are not my cup of tea erotically speaking either. That's why I could not contribute much in the way of suggestions.
But I think your pictures are often very well composed and even more importantly incredibly inventive.
The same goes, btw, for some of the suggestions made by other people on your threads.
This is not a problem because my tastes are a bit more diverse than yours and your pictures have a bit more story than mine ;)
There are plenty of suggestions already :)
What are you up to, my friend? You have posted zilch for over a week now…..
Still alive, but I am pretty busy now so no time to do anything new.
we kinda miss this
this is a magic show i would pay to see
Be still, my beating heart…..
Small update to remind everyone that I am still alive LOL
thanks add 3 more one a little higher and 2 more at the bottom, then the same to the little girls ass 8 in hers
You are getting greedy LOL
Some time ago you wanted just 3 ;)
ok 3 for the older girl, 5 for the little girl
the last skewer in the little girls ass will go across her anus after a male puts his dick in her ass skewer his dick
Yay. So great to see you back! :-)
Although I have to say Skewers through ass and tits is getting boring. We had that So many times. I'd like to see skewers through chest and belly - from all sorts of sides and at all sorts of angles - turn the little girl into a pincushion!
(nonfatal of course, but they're immortal anyway. But this would be plausibly nonfatal - as in miraculously (magically!) missed all the vitals on all of them)
you know, like the trick where a girl hides in a box and then the magician sticks swords through the box. except in this case the girl is the box ;)
Well, those girls are not so straight "immortal" or else it is not interesting as there will be no magic. They are just the same immortal as any other magicians of the stage who get cut in half or get skewered with swords.
I know, skewering is pretty common and this is why this time it is more focused on the magic than torture and I may not do very detailed skewering process scenes.
I hope that it will be more interesting than usual ;) because skewering is not the main topic of this trick and there will be something more to see.
Considering pincushion, I was thinking about that but it may take way too long to fill her with so many skewers and then nothing is going to happen anyway so it will be pretty boring.
fair enough! We're looking forward to what you have planned :-)
how about transferring the little girls ass cheeks to the skewered girls breast
…and now the face! :)
I strongly agree with this. How about some nice skewers through the cheeks?
Onix 07/07/19 (Sun) 12:03:12 No.31328>>31314
I was talking about story realism, not about style. On that aspect, we are pretty similar.
But that's interesting to hear too, no need to be sorry. I really want to know what exactly you find wrong with my style, but probably we should discuss that on some of my threads not here.
Dear Onix, my respect for the understanding way you treat the posted criticism. I'd like to contribute to that by clarifying my views.
The characters you create for your stories look absoluteley great, be it that they look superclean as if they have been in the shower for an hour.
However the stories that you present come from a dreamworld which makes that your series lack a certain tension of reality. That -sadly- reduces your work rather to an interesting collector's item intead of a piece of work that moves the soul. I regret to say that this distinguishes your work from Drabok's.
interesting remark. I agree that they are super clean but that is a kinda typical issue with all 3d artwork in existence not only mine. I made some experimental attempts to change that, but unless it is somehow required by the story there is no point in adding that extra complexity.
Speaking about stories themselves, yes, so far most of my stuff is surrealistic. It is supposed to be something similar to the "Alice in the wonderland" but I would not assume that as some fault because this is actually what guro is about for me in the first place: breaking rules of the reality. They are not really supposed to move your soul they are more like "Tom and Jerry" cartoon for adults.
I disagree that Drabok fantasy is that much more realistic because his world is unreal from another direction. In my stories, "victims" are invincible, while in his stories victims are disposable, but essentially it is the same thing. You may just not notice it. Funny enough, in the only story where characters were not disposable and which supposedly could move your soul, they actually survived.
Eventually, I also may do some stories with disposable victims or maybe even something completely realistic. But I do not see a big demand for that. I was trying to ask you all to talk more about story content itself as what kind of stories you would like to see but so far all requests are limited to some specific scenes without mentioning any narrative why that should happen.
Overall i think Drabok's stories are more realistic than yours, but he did some fantasy stuff too. He had two stories involving monsters and he has a bunch of stories in a dystopian future where girls get executed for pretty much no reason. Interestingly those are also his stories where i like the background story the least, i prefer his other background stories, simply because i like more realistic scenarios. The rest are in my opinion all much more realistic than your stories. They might have some plot holes and many things in those stories would be very unlikely to happen in reality, but overall those stories seem not completely impossible to happen.
You know my opinion about his one story where his characters survived, no need to get into that again. It's safe to say his CDL story is still my favorite among his stories, partly because those girls had some real character, but i very much would have preferred a different ending.
One important difference between you and Drabok: Your victims are always consenting. That's the one thing that sets your work completely apart from Drabok, since his victims are never consenting. I'm not sure if it's fair to say this makes his work more realistic, but in my mind that's exactly what happens: I expect a girl to be horrified at those brutal tortures, i don't expect her to go along with it willingly. I don't expect you to change that, since it's clearly the defining element that sets your art apart from the art other artists like Drabok are creating. You have fans who probably like this style more than the alternative, and i guess you enjoy this much more than the stuff Drabok is usually creating. But this is the reason why i usually don't comment in your threads, your pictures are looking great but it's just not my fetish if the girls are consenting.
I am the other way around.
Myself i really like, that the girls partipiate willingly and not forced.
And Draboks Art is all about "torture" and more realistic.
But torture is only a small part of guro and i really like your art more, because you make really different things, you always have a surprise for us.
Debreast, real impossible penetrations, real funny and different circumstances. Please dont change anything.
You and KillerX are the best two guro Artists that i ever saw. Since KillerX dont make anything new, you are without doubt the number one at this genre.
Actually, you are slightly wrong, as not all my characters are consenting, some are, some not. If you look more closely, Drabok's characters also eventually become consenting ;) His latest story characters happily walk to their doom. He also posted one completely consensual story on pixiv but not here.
Also, It is even hard to tell what is more realistic, because you all unanimously assure that you would never do anything like that in the real life and probably would not even jerk off on the real video of someone being murdered by some serial killer.
While much of the stuff in my stories really happened in real life and events that happen in my stories are actually something which I would do under the right circumstances. There are quite a lot of people who would give consent for all that as well and even there are people who actually react that way.
Of course, there are differences but realism is not one of them.
Considering what you can expect from me, consent is not absolutely required in my stories. A more important characteristic is that torture mutilation and possibly death is not some big deal to care about. On the level of consent, my story Of "cheerleader club" is similar to Drabok's girls being executed.
So it is entirely possible to see anything but one relatively important issue is that whatever happens must have some kind of reasoning behind it and if you did not notice I am pretty picky about that reasoning so if it would be some guy torturing some girls I must know why he is doing that in detail what is relationship between those characters. Simply doing something for no reason is not interesting and also not possible to show proper emotions and reaction.
If you have some ideas for a story with the decent reasonable plot I may do it.
Currently, I have some plans to make a story about WW2 Soviet partisan. Or possibly even jews ;) that would be like 99% realistic but I wonder what kind of reception it would get.
Once I mentioned that on another forum and it practically ended with outrage, because fantasy about torturing and murdering innocent women is ok but not if that woman is Jewish LOL
It may be strange but there are books written by death camp and gulag inmates about all that stuff and they are extremely funny regardless of the fact on how horrible are things that are described. Maybe you know the Movie "Life Is Beautiful"
What's happening in Drabok's stories isn't really consent: The girls in the summer camp are walking to their doom because they have no idea what's going to happen to them. This seems overall realistic to me, although the girls certainly seem very naive, not even talking about the parents. And in that story on pixiv, the way i understand it the girl is not fighting back because she was promised money for her parents this way, while she would still die if she tried to fight back. But i have to admit, i don't completely get that mentality.
The point about consent and realism for me: Of course masochists exist in this world. There are a bunch of people who get sexually turned on by getting tortured in real life. But most of them have limits and certainly don't want to suffer any permanent injuries. There have been exceptions, up to people agreeing to getting themselves killed, but they are incredibly rare. So your stories are in that way realistic since there have indeed been people who would agree to something like that. But if you take some random girls, it would be extremely unrealistic if they would react that way, out of the general population the vast majority of potential victims would react in a way similar to what Drabok is usually showing.
Your description of your work is probably more fitting, with torture etc not being a big deal. But that's also not that realistic for me: For the torturers it might not be a big deal, but for the victims it should be. In my mind, everything that is happening to the victims in these stories is usually the worst thing that ever happened to them, and that's showing in their reactions.
Can't really say anything about your WW2 story idea. It could be interesting, of course it's a sensitive topic for some people.
I have some story ideas, but they are focused on my fetishes, so i have my doubts if they would work for you. Maybe this one could, since unlike Drabok you have done scenes with kids torturing each other, but i'm not sure since our ideas are usually very much opposite of each other:
Somewhere in a rural area, we have a school bus. On this route there are a bunch of girls and one boy, i'm thinking the boy should be a younger teenager maybe 12 or 13 years old, the girls ranging everywhere from 8 to 16. These are the girls i'm currently thinking about: Two older girls (15 or 16). They are sisters and they have bullied the boy for years. Three girls around his age (12 or 13). He had a crush on one of them and asked her out, she rejected him, told her friends and all three have been making fun of him since then. Two young girls (8 or 9). One is his little sister and the other her best friend. His little sister is the favorite child at home and can do nothing wrong while everything is his fault, and she knows it and has terrorized him in every way possible just because she can.
So overall, the boy hates all of those girls for different reasons. Then we have the bus driver, a creepy guy who has driven these kids for some time and really just wanted to rape the older girls for a while and now he has decided it's time to act since he won't have this job much longer. This time he has brought his buddy along, another creepy guy who has a thing for young girls. They have decided to kidnap these kids and have some fun with the girls, they have some vague ideas including a good location but haven't really thought things through. The boy isn't part of their plan, they aren't sure what to do with him. He is pretty smart and convinces them to let him join, and it turns out he is much more sadistic than the guys, and he knows all of these girls really well and can use that knowledge against them.
I won't go into details about how to torture the girls, but i'm thinking as the story progresses most of it should be things the boy wants to have done to the girls, while the guys are getting more and more impressed with his ideas. I think a possible ending for that story would be that the boy somehow sets it up that everybody else is dead, the kidnappers shot by the police, and he gets "rescued" as the only survivor of this tragedy.
It's up to you if you would do something like that, i currently have no other ideas that seem more likely to be something you would like to do.
Well, I would say that it does not matter that much if one is tricked or agrees consciously. From the outside, it still looks the same. Anyone can add one line of narrative that "character got paid to do it" use some hypnosis, drugs or mind control gun LOL
So I guess you can agree that the main issue is not about consent or realism but about the fact of how victims react to torture and death.
While of course, it is uncommon to find people willing to die it is even more uncommon to find people who rape teenage girls and then invite their necrophiliac friends to fuck corpses devoured by dogs. Looks pretty cool but only happens in the wildest fantasies.
Considering your story scenario, In fact, this is totally possible for me to do. It also fits my preference of reverse domination when someone who appears weak dominates one who looks stronger. so the idea of the 13-year boy being the mastermind of the evil plan is great. It looks like the erotic verison of "Scott Tenorman Must Die" Southpark episode
It would be an opportunity to make a story with a very good and complex plot which has a bit more than just porn value.
It will count more as horror story than porn.
Although the idea of torturing and murdering little sister is not very appealing to me. I think some small changes can be made to make it more reasonable and simpler:
A single father marries a woman with 2 daughters who become his stepsisters and then everything more or less as you describe he is mistreated at home and school and gets revenge.
There may be some technical and logistic problems with that huge number of characters so it can be reduced to something more reasonable.
Since this seems to be a pretty long story I do not promise anything when it will be done if ever, but It will be on my list of plans.
Those surprises are not going to end soon.
After all my main fetish is "variety" LOL
I hope this will be a more interesting magic trick that just plain torture :)
I get your point, and you are probably right. I'm looking for average girls, i want their reactions and everything about them to be what you would expect from a random girl, that's the point where i want realism in the way that it's not only possible but also very likely to happen if an average girl got into that situation. While for the situation itself, the realism i'm looking for is just that it's something that could happen in real life even though it would be incredibly unlikely and i only think it gets unrealistic when it goes from "extremely unlikely" to "completely impossible".
About my story scenario: Small changes are ok, and this seems like a pretty good change, i think i like stepsisters more than a little sister. I had the general idea for this story for a while, but the number of girls and his relation to them is something i made up on the spot, so adjust that in any way you want. It would be great if you did the story eventually, but it's completely up to you - i know this would be a long story, i really can't expect anything, so it's already great that you consider it.
I guess I also want to say something on the realism discussion. I completely agree with Onix that my stories are in many ways just as unrealistic as his are.
And who prefers which kind of unrealism is a matter of taste in the end.
His stories are set in a fantasy/fairytale setting. But from that starting point he develops them quite "realistically", meaning he sticks to the rules of the particular fantasy setting.
Some of my stories may be set a world more close to real life. But then they often develop quite unrealistically, breaking a lot of the rules and probabilities in the real world.
They nail the tall girl to the table and then stick skewers all through her body (navel ,womb ,limbs ,nipples ,inserting one into her peehole..) just missing the vital organs keeping her alive for a very long time.
At the grand finale they start sticking them through her head, not killing her yet but causing brain damage which expresses through her eyes rolling and tongue sticking out.
That's so horrible. LOL
But this time I decided to focus more on the magic than just plain meaningless mutilations.
It is juts unclear if any of you even see anything of that at all ? :)
I enjoy the show a lot. Varieté at its best, risky, magical, entertaining!
there's enough mindless slaughter out there already, I think its good to have some performance art.
I still would like if the lil girl had the spikes all through her body, but as part of the show and non-fatal.
ok then the artistic and magical aspect of it is that the girls survives :)
Hmm, doing plain piercing through her body is a bit too plain and straightforward. everyone will be bored to death watching endless pictures of spikes going in the various places then taking them out
But I have one interesting idea similar to that which should a bit more interesting how to do it all in one go. So maybe I will do it after all.
But that trick may be too similar to the trick which should be done now.>>31446
considering her survival, getting pierced is a bit too tame in comparison to what is supposed to happen later. so it is sort of a waste of time.
I kinda did not plan it to be so long but ended with something that was not planned at all.
Hmmm….Yessica 3000 comes to mind…..
Oh please, please keep going :) This isn't exactly what I had in mind, its way better!
I think I can speak for everyone here when I say we love unanticipated surprises :)
Ouch! Looks like an unpleasant accident for her. Nice idea ;)
No worry my friend. Knowing Onix it'll come out of her mouth in the shape of a oversized paperclip. ;)
Dear Onix, I trust you to come up with a beautiful glass jar to hold your skewers.
And fix the bloody thing to the table so that Drabok can't pinch it.
You rascal! It wasn't yours either…
I don't know what to do with you.
I think it's for the best to just enjoy and admire your work.
However, i'm still very curious to what kind of beautiful glass jar you vome up with. ;)
Great work Onix, you are one of the best autor!!
Gurovision promises to be your best job!
Maybe some boys will add to this thread
"Maybe some boys will add to this thread"
I'd rather wish they wouldn't. Not all people like boy-guro, and there already is a thread for cutup minidicks over in>>26831
and a very awesome mixed character one in >>9079
Let's keep this one all female, to keep it balanced :)
Setting aside the question of the ownership of the can of skewers (I'm afraid I can't give it back right now, I still need it) I wanted to mention that both of these nuns look really lovely (Yes, even the older one)
I do not have that much time now as before, but still decided to finish this scene to some extent.
as "almost" right LOL
currently I have no plans to add male characters to this show, mostly because of technical and length issues. It already happens to be longer than I expected.
I was thinking about taking someone from audience but maybe I will rather create another group with diffrent types of tricks later.
Will we see the cut-the-woman-in-half trick?
Maybe, Not sure yet because there are so many possible tricks to chose ;)